Perezida Paul Kagame aherutse kugirana ikiganiro n’ikinyamakuru Jeune Afrique, agaruka ku ngingo zitandukanye zirimo ibivugwa ku Rwanda, ku Karere na Afurika ndetse no ku buzima bwe bwite.
Muri icyo kiganiro cyabaye tariki 20 Mutarama i Kigali cyashyizwe mu Kinyarwanda, Perezida Kagame yasubije ibibazo bitandukanye birimo bimwe muri ibi bikurikira:
Umwaka wa 2021 waranzwe n’ihirikwa ry’ubutegetsi nko muri Mali, Guinée na Sudani ndetse hari n’intambara muri Ethiopie. Inshuro nyinshi, AU yagiye iruca ikarumira….
Nko muri Ethiopie, byarashobokaga ko ariya makimbirane akumirwa ariko amazi yari yarenze inkombe. Turifuza Ethiopie yunze ubumwe. Twizeye ko ibiganiro bya ngombwa bizagera igihe bikagerwaho.
Ku kijyanye n’ihirikwa ry’ubutegetsi, ntekereza ko biriya biba byatangiye mbere kuko nko muri biriya bihugu, hari ibibazo bimaze igihe bidakemurwa. Nko muri Sudani, hari hari ibibazo ku bwa Omar al Bashir, birakomeza na nyuma y’inzibacyuho.
Ibibazo nka biriya biba bishoboka kwisubiramo uruhande rwose Umuryango wa Afurika Yunze Ubumwe yaba ihagazemo kuko ntabwo ariyo iyobora ibyo bihugu.
Hari aho AU n’indi miryango mpuzamahanga yagira uruhare mu gufasha ariko biza nyuma y’uko ibihugu ubwabyo byishatsemo ibisubizo. Ubushobozi buke bw’Umuryango wa Afurika Yunze Ubumwe nabwo ni izindi ntege nke, ntabwo twabihakana.
Mubona mute igaruka ry’abasirikare mu ruhando rwa politiki? Si ugusubira inyuma kwa demokarasi?
Hari aho ahubwo ari ugusubira inyuma kw’imiyoborere. Ntabwo buri gihe ari ikosa ry’abasirikare, n’abasivile babifitemo uruhare.Ubundi inshingano z’abasirikare si ugukora kuriya ariko ntabwo twakwirengagiza ko abasivile nabo bajya bakora amakosa.
Niba se hariho Guverinoma y’abasivile ariko ibintu bikadogera, abantu bagapfa ibibazo bikarushaho kwiyongera, hanyuma abayobozi bakifashisha abasirikare mu kwiba amatora, ni nde wanengwa mu gihe igisirikare gihiritse iyo Guverinoma? Ntabwo numva ko twanenga gusa abasirikare hanyuma tukareka abasivile babifahisha ngo bagume ku butegetsi.
Ntekereza ko ugendeye kuri ubwo busesenguzi, hari abavuga ko hari uguhirika ubutegetsi kuba gukenewe n’ukuba kudakenewe.
Hanyuma rero, nubwo igisirikare cyabona ibisobanuro ku mpamvu cyahiritse ubutegetsi mu minsi ya mbere n’abasivile bakabyishimira, haba hakiri ikibazo: Ese ba basirikare bazabasha gushyiraho inzibacyuho izakemura ibibazo byatumye bahirika ubutegetsi? Nibyo dutegereje kureba muri Guinée no muri Mali.
Mutekereza ko guhirika ubutegetsi bidashoboka mu Rwanda?
Ntabwo mbizi, ariko reka mbisobanure mu bundi buryo. Mbere na mbere abanyarwanda nibo bavuga uko babitekereza, babishingiye kuho twavuye, ibyo twakoze n’ibyo turi gukora.
Ikindi, ntabwo mbona ikintu cyatuma haba abasirikare cyangwa abasirikare barakara kugeza aho haba ihirikwa ry’ubutegetsi. Uburyo bwacu bw’imiyoborere mu mboni zanjye, ni ukwita ku bibazo by’abaturage.
Ntabwo mbona ibintu nshobora gukora cyangwa se inzego zishobora gukora byatuma ibintu bigera aho ngaho.
Kuba sosiyete y’Abarusiya Wagner iri muri Centrafrique na Mozambique aho ingabo z’u Rwanda ziri ndetse no muri Mali, ni ikibazo gihangayikishije cyane u Bufaransa n’u Burayi.
Bimaze iminsi bihanganishije u Bufaransa na Mali. Ese namwe ntabwo mushyigikiye ko abo bantu baza muri Afurika, cyangwa ni uburenganzira bw’ibyo bihugu?
Ibihugu bya Afurika nibyo bigomba guhitamo ikibibereye hashingiwe ku mahame mpuzamahanga twese tugenderaho.
Numva ko hakwiriye kubaho uburyo biriya bihugu, u Bufaransa n’u Burusiya byaganira bigakemura ikibazo. Ntabwo numva uburyo u Rwanda rwabyinjiramo.
Ku ruhande rwacu, duhitamo kuguma hanze y’ibibazo tudafite icyo twabikoraho. Guverinoma ya Mali ikwiriye kuganira na AU ndetse na EU ku kibazo cya Wagner muri icyo gihugu.
Mwagize uruhare rukomeye mu itegurwa ry’inama izahuza Umuryango wa Afurika Yunze Ubumwe n’Umuryango w’Ubumwe bw’u Burayi iteganyijwe tariki 17 na 18 Gashyantare, hitezwemo iki?
Kuri ubu hari inama zimwe na zimwe zabaye nk’umuhango kuri bamwe. Bakaza byo kwitabira gusa kurusha ikizava muri iyo nama. Iyi nama yo rero tuyitezeho umusaruro ufatika. Mfite icyizere. Umuryango wa Afurika Yunze Ubumwe urabizi, ndatekereza ko ari ngombwa gukora ibintu mu buryo butandukanye n’ubusanzwe.
Ku ruhande rwa EU naho ni uko. Turashimira uruhare rwa Perezida Emmanuel Macron, Perezida w’akanama ka EU, Charles Michel na Perezida wa Komisiyo ya EU Ursula von der Leyen.
Hamwe n’abandi banyaburayi, bariteguye kugira ngo iyi nama izazane impinduka nziza mu mubano usanzwe hagati ya Afurika n’u Burayi.
Iyi migabane yombi isangiye amateka akomeye. Uburyo bwiza bwo kujya mbere ni ukureba iby’uyu munsi n’ahazaza n’umubano wubakiye ku bwubahane. U Burayi bushobora kuba umufatanyabikorwa w’ingenzi wa Afurika, gutyo gutyo ariko ni ngombwa ko bikorwa mu buryo budasanzwe.
Mu bizaganirwaho hagaragaramo ibijyanye n’imiyoborere n’umutekano, mubibona gute?
Ni ingenzi cyane. Iyo imiyoborere imeze neza, biroroha kugenzura ibibazo by’umutekano. N’iyo bigeze ku mutekano muke, bihita bigira ingaruka no ku miyoborere. Ibyo bibazo byombi tugomba kubikemurira icyarimwe. Turabibona hirya no hino muri Afurika no ku Isi, ko iyo ibyo bibazo byirundanyije ari bwo hinjirira imitwe y’abahezanguni yaba ishingiye ku idini cyangwa ku bwoko.
Urugero nka RDC, imaze imyaka myinshi yibasiwe n’umutekano muke. Ingabo za Loni zishinzwe kugarura amahoro zihamaze imyaka isaga 20, miliyari zisaga 35 z’amadolari zimaze gukoreshwa. Ariko se byatanze uwuhe musaruro? Ntabwo twakomeza gutakaza amafaranga tudatekereza ku musaruro.
Yaba Loni cyangwa indi miryango mpuzaturere, hakwiriye kujyaho uburyo bwo kugenzura ibikorwa nk’ibyo. Bamwe muri twe bazabigarukaho muri iyo nama.
Tugarutse ku nkingo, benshi muri bagenzi bawe b’Abanyafurika bamaganye ukwikubira kw’inkingo gukorwa n’ibihugu bikize, namwe niko mubibona?
Buri wese afite uburenganzira bwo gukoresha imvugo yumva ikwiriye. Kuri njye, mpitamo kuvuga ko hariho ‘ubusumbane mu by’inkingo’. Ntabwo inkingo zisaranganywa mu buryo bungana.
Mu gihe mu bihugu bimwe na bimwe hari ububiko buhagije bushobora gutuma bakingira abaturage bose, hari ibindi bitabufite. Hashize igihe ntacyo babona. Uburyo bwo gukemura icyo kibazo, ni uguha ibyo bihugu uburyo bwo kwikorera izo nkingo.
Hari igenzura ryakozwe vuba aha rikorwa n’ikigo gishinzwe ubuvuzi cya AU, Africa CDC, ryerekanye ko 43 % by’ababajijwe batekereza ko bari kugeragerezwaho inkingo n’Abanyaburayi. Byagenda gute ngo uwo mubare munini w’Abanyafurika batumva ibyo kwikingiza ugabanuke?
Icyo ni ikibazo dusanga mu bice bitandukanye by’Isi harimo na Afurika ndetse no mu Rwanda kirahari, nubwo ari umubare muto. Icyakora ikibazo gikomeye gihari si abanga kwikingiza ahubwo ni uburyo bwo kubona inkingo.
Duhanganye n’icyorezo twatangiye tudafitiye igisubizo. Ku bw’amahirwe haje kuboneka urukingo. Ntabwo rukemura byose ariko rurafasha mu guhangana n’icyorezo. Hazahoraho abantu batemera ibisubizo by’inzobere muri siyansi.
Mu bwubahane bw’imyemerere ya buri muntu, dushobora kubiganiraho tukumvikana ko uburyo bumwe buzadufasha kuva muri iki kibazo, ari urukingo.
Imyaka itatu irashize muyoboye Umuryango wa Afurika Yunze Ubumwe, ese mwishimiye ishyirwa mu bikorwa ry’amavugurura mwagizemo uruhare?
Hari ibintu bikomeye tumaze kugeraho. Igitekerezo cy’uko buri gihugu gitanga umusanzu hashingiwe ku bukungu bwacyo ku ngengo y’imari ya AU, byatumye hashyirwaho ikigega cy’amahoro kimaze kugeramo hafi miliyoni 200 z’amadolari.
Ibyo bizadufasha kuba twashakisha andi mikoro ariko mbere na mbere twagombaga kubanza kwishakamo ubushobozi mbere yo kujya gushakisha ahandi.
Twabashije kugabanya umubare wa za komisiyo n’imyanya imwe n’imwe mu muryango, dutangiza Isoko rusange rya Afurika kandi ibihugu biri kuryinjiramo ku bwinshi kuko byumva akamaro karyo.
Hari ibihugu bimwe bya Afurika byagaragaje kutishimira ko Israel iba igihugu cy’indorerezi muri AU, mubitekerezaho iki?
Buri gihugu gifite uburenganzira bwo kugira icyo kibivugaho. Hari ibihugu bidafite ikibazo kuri uko kuba indorerezi kwa Israel, ibindi ntibibishyigikiye.
Njye uko mbibona, umwanzuro wafashwe na Perezida wa Komisiyo ya AU, Moussa Faki, wari wo ukurikije ibyo amabwiriza avuga.
Icya kabiri, Israel ifitanye umubano n’ibihugu 46 bya Afurika ku buryo kuyiha kuba indorerezi nta kibazo biteje.
Hanyuma, uwo mwanya wo kuba indorerezi, uzatuma habasha kubaho ibiganiro. Ntabwo bivuze ko ibibazo byazamuwe na bimwe mu bihugu bidahari ariko bizabasha kuganirwano n’impande zose bireba.
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